[bikeqld] Coro Drive bikepath update?

Tue May 26 19:24:09 CDT 2009

Point taken Pete ...

However, others would argue that urban design 
requires legibility such that what appears to 
meet particular needs and/or "reasonable" 
expectations, does indeed do so... ;-)

The plethora of signs (and various physical 
barriers eg fences) especially those added later, 
is more often an indication of bad urban design 
... relying then on signs and barriers which signs surprisingly often are ...!

At a more theoretical level, claiming, gaining 
and/or providing exclusivity relates to both 
symbolic and actual political power and to 
exclusion politics ... in much the same way that 
facilities are usually provided by "experts" but 
despite that, either don't work or have 
significant failings for intended use and/or users.

Minorities don't really matter ... but can be 
further marginalised by providing poor, 
inadequate or substandard facilities they then 
either don't use ... or use incorrectly ie not as 
intended or instructed ... hence the signs also 
serve to remind us who really is in control ... 
and that we should be "good" and comply.

Put another way granting exclusivity is another 
form of symbolic power ... empowering one or more 
groups which may well then act more uncritically 
or supportively (or be expected to) in relation 
to their benefactors, while further marginalising 
or disempowering others not included ... ie excluded.

One of the issues that emerged on the Goodwill 
Bridge was how to make provision for the 
inevitability of people on the bridge wanting to 
(i) stop part way and/or (ii) have a look from 
the other side of the bridge eg at a boat passing 
underneath. That's what people do ...! Variation 
is another esp regular users who enjoy the 
experience of the environment/setting.

It makes a lot of sense for a lot of reasons that 
people walking or cycling might choose to vary 
which side of the Green Bridge they decided to 
use ... including how the approaches are designed 
and what one might reasonably expect approaching 
such a structure ... irrespective of signs which 
attempt to overcome what appear to be the obvious route options to take.

An analysis of the "Green Bridge" (and for 
comparative study, the "Goodwill Bridge") 
exploring these and related issues and the 
relative utility for the various users and uses, 
would be a useful exercise in urban design ... 
but probably not at UD001 level ...!

The discussion re the detour along the Coro Drive 
corridor for (i) peds and in particular, people 
with any kind of reduced physical ability and 
(ii) cyclists is illustrative ...!

MY.........................

At 11:05 AM 26/05/2009, Peter Whittle wrote:

>Content-Language: en-US
>Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
> 
>boundary="_000_51FC1E99A89C9E4796A8C2E296FFFBAE07523A04B8QUTEXMBX03qut_"
>
>You even get cyclists and pedestrians using the 
>wrong side of the Green Bridge, even though 
>there is a perfectly good and well-signed option 
>nearby. Itâ€™s facultative compliance with rules 
>(â€œIâ€™ll comply when I think I should) – an 
>entrenched culltural Brisbane trait – itâ€™s not 
>peds or cyclists or motorists, but the whole 
>bloody population – just look at motorists and 
>red lights for a clear example that itâ€™s not just â€œusâ€.
>
>Pete
>
>From: bikeqld-bounces at bikeqld.org.au 
>[mailto:bikeqld-bounces at bikeqld.org.au] On Behalf Of Anthony Lee
>Sent: Tuesday, 26 May 2009 10:21 AM
>To: bikeqld at bikeqld.org.au
>Subject: Re: [bikeqld] Coro Drive bikepath update?
>
>Hi Michael,
>
>As of this morning (7am), it was still one way. 
>I am actually trying to figure out what happens 
>if a controller on one misjudges
>and let cyclists enter his end when there are 
>still cyclist coming through the other end? 
>Also, this morning there was at least
>one pedestrian who still wanted to use the 
>temporary structure only to be told by the controller. There are no signs
>telling pedestrian to use the upper footpath.
>
>I have also tried the alternative path via 
>Southbank and UQ Lake but now that I lived in St 
>Lucia, I found it faster going on Coro Drive. Riding from
>Southbank to Annerley is OK but I feel Coro 
>Drive a little less dangerous. Others might disagree.
>
>One more thing, currently, a lot of pedestrians 
>who uses the path outside the old ABC studio regularly disobey the
>bike only sign. I wondered how the BCC will 
>reinforce the bike-only path. In fact, even on Western Freeway bikeway
>you still get a lot pedestrians (may I called 
>them idiots?) who regularly ignore the fact that these bikeways are BIKE ONLY.
>Is it funny that the BCC and other authorities 
>are so keen to crack down on cyclists but not pedestrians doing the "WRONG"
>thing.
>
>Anthony Lee
>The Doctor -- the last of the Time Lords?
>........-- __o
>....-- _ \<,_
>........(_) / (_)
>E-Mail: doctorw1963 at yahoo.com.au
>
>
>
>From: Michael Yeates <michael at yeatesit.biz>
>To: bikeqld at bikeqld.org.au
>Sent: Tuesday, 26 May, 2009 9:09:49 AM
>Subject: [bikeqld] Coro Drive bikepath update?
>
>Is the temporary Bicentennial Bikeway bikepath 
>to Park Road still only operating one way for cyclists?
>
>I ask because it would appear that BCC 
>"designed" the facility quite deliberately ... 
>as you (should?) do when you "design" something to be constructed.
>
>However, it was originally "designed" and 
>intended for two way use by cyclists AND by pedestrians.
>
>So why once the pedestrians were no longer able 
>to use it, was it suddenly turned into one way for cyclists?
>
>One answer appears to be the hoary old excuse 
>"cyclists travelling too fast ie too 
>dangerously". Too fast? Too dangerous? For whom?
>
>So if all this is deliberate policy, there is 
>one good outcome. It will mean that cyclists can 
>travel as fast as they wish on the CYCLISTS ONLY 
>sections ... ie once it turns from the "shared 
>footpath" it has been allowed (indeed was 
>designed) to become to a CYCLISTS ONLY bikepath ...!
>
>But perhaps not?
>
>It appears there have been a sufficient number 
>of "complaints" and/or reports to police to 
>justify BCC introducing the one way for 
>cyclists. Mind you none of the complaints are 
>available and if details are sought, they sound pretty sketchy.
>
>So it may be that Council is designing the "new" 
>path width such that it will still be 
>substandard for the speeds at which some 
>cyclists wish to travel even on a CYCLISTS ONLY path.
>
>So put another way, since it seems difficult to 
>put an enforceable speed limit on bikepaths, 
>what sort of facility is needed so the fastest 
>cyclists can use bikepaths but be considered to 
>be doing so safely by police, Council, and the wider community?
>
>I guess I am asking why all the initial fuss 
>about the temporary structure ...?
>
>Does it appear or is it the case that a 
>substantial number of cyclists no longer use it?
>
>If so where do they/you go ?
>
>MY............................
>
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